WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.930 --> 00:00:03.350 align:center line:-1Interviewer: Thank you for accepting my interview. 2 00:00:03.360 --> 00:00:08.990 align:center line:-1 Interviewer: Would you please tell me when you were born? You don’t need to say the exact date; just “1940’s,” “1950’s,” "1960s" will do. 3 00:00:09.000 --> 00:00:11.990 align:center line:-1 1950’s. 4 00:00:12.000 --> 00:00:20.100 align:center line:-1 Interviewer: Would you please tell me, during the ten years from 1966 to 1976, in which area of China did you mainly stay? 5 00:00:20.110 --> 00:00:23.880 align:center line:-1 Tianjin City. I was born in Tianjin. 6 00:00:23.890 --> 00:00:31.670 align:center line:-1 Interviewer: Since you were born in the 1950’s, you must have many memories of this decade. 7 00:00:31.680 --> 00:00:38.330 align:center line:-1 Interviewer: Even given several days, you probably couldn’t share them all. If we only give you ten minutes, or in other words, 8 00:00:38.340 --> 00:00:46.270 align:center line:-1 Interviewer: ...in the first ten minutes of the interview, what would you most want to share with us? Please speak freely. 9 00:00:46.280 --> 00:00:58.460 align:center line:-1 I was 14 or 15 years old that time, and I felt the world suddenly changed. 10 00:00:58.470 --> 00:01:06.280 align:center line:-1 I lived in a university faculty residence compound; all of my neighbors were “Misters” [prestigious intellectuals]. 11 00:01:06.290 --> 00:01:11.990 align:center line:-1 The relationships between us all were bound by etiquette; it was a very polite environment. 12 00:01:12.000 --> 00:01:14.990 align:center line:-1 But suddenly, at this time, it turned into a place where people could just casually be beaten by others. 13 00:01:15.000 --> 00:01:18.330 align:center line:-1 The compound also became a “cow-demons and snake-spirits” compound. 14 00:01:18.340 --> 00:01:26.440 align:center line:-1 I remember an old man in our building, who was very elegant, liked calligraphy, and also liked raising crickets. 15 00:01:26.450 --> 00:01:30.440 align:center line:-1 One day all his cricket jars were broken to pieces, and he was beaten. 16 00:01:30.450 --> 00:01:35.480 align:center line:-1 It was the first time I saw someone be beaten. It was horrible. 17 00:01:35.490 --> 00:01:40.060 align:center line:-1 At the same time, not only did the place where I lived suffer a disaster, but so did the school. 18 00:01:40.070 --> 00:01:47.820 align:center line:-1 What is engraved on my heart is this: one day, I was suddenly made to sit in the middle surrounded by the crowd. 19 00:01:47.830 --> 00:01:50.990 align:center line:-1 [Those of us in the middle] were made to admit that we were "sons of dogs." 20 00:01:51.000 --> 00:01:54.320 align:center line:-1 I was also made to explain my father’s "problematic history." 21 00:01:54.330 --> 00:01:58.240 align:center line:-1 It was as if our files were open to the public, and what my father had done before, everyone knew. 22 00:01:58.250 --> 00:02:01.690 align:center line:-1 At that time, there were a few core members of the Red Guards in our class. 23 00:02:01.700 --> 00:02:08.360 align:center line:-1 What was unforgettable was that suddenly people were divided into different ranks. 24 00:02:08.370 --> 00:02:15.870 align:center line:-1 It seemed that [to them] I was no longer a “successor (to the revolution),” but their enemy. This was a horrible thing. 25 00:02:15.880 --> 00:02:21.290 align:center line:-1 Then we could go in and out only through the “dog door,” also known as the “dog hole.” 26 00:02:21.300 --> 00:02:31.290 align:center line:-1 I remembered some "son of a dog" in my class led us in climbing the wall, since by climbing the wall, we could avoid the dog hole. 27 00:02:31.300 --> 00:02:34.040 align:center line:-1 Interviewer: What was the “dog hole”? 28 00:02:34.050 --> 00:02:41.560 align:center line:-1 It was a small door especially for “sons of dogs,” since we couldn’t just use the same door as everyone else. 29 00:02:41.570 --> 00:02:43.120 align:center line:-1 Interviewer: Who set up that door? 30 00:02:43.130 --> 00:02:50.410 align:center line:-1 Those students did it themselves. They could do whatever they wanted to torture people. 31 00:02:50.420 --> 00:02:59.950 align:center line:-1 I felt that impact was just like a drowning calamity, because I was so young. 32 00:02:59.960 --> 00:03:07.340 align:center line:-1 If you find out you’re [one of the] “cow-demons and snake-spirits,” you feel such shame, you can’t hold your head up high. You can only cry. 33 00:03:07.350 --> 00:03:12.080 align:center line:-1 That day after being tortured, I went home and picked up some scissors, wanting to slit my wrists. 34 00:03:12.090 --> 00:03:14.380 align:center line:-1 I didn’t want to live anymore. 35 00:03:14.390 --> 00:03:19.020 align:center line:-1 I didn’t end up cutting myself. One reason is that I didn’t know how to do it. 36 00:03:19.030 --> 00:03:23.980 align:center line:-1 Also, my family called me to eat dinner, so I just came out of the bathroom. 37 00:03:23.990 --> 00:03:31.980 align:center line:-1 Even now, I haven’t shaken off that feeling of inferiority. 38 00:03:31.990 --> 00:03:39.480 align:center line:-1 Everywhere, out in the streets, people were shaving other people’s heads, beating people, whatever they felt like doing. 39 00:03:39.490 --> 00:03:44.020 align:center line:-1 I can hardly describe it. This kind of memory is one page in my coming-of-age story. 40 00:03:44.030 --> 00:03:47.990 align:center line:-1 Look, there's my cat. 41 00:03:48.000 --> 00:03:49.990 align:center line:-1 It’s not afraid of strangers. 42 00:03:50.000 --> 00:03:51.090 align:center line:-1 Interviewer: It’s a pretty cat! 43 00:03:51.100 --> 00:03:53.720 align:center line:-1 It is pretty. It's a Scottish fold cat. 44 00:03:53.730 --> 00:04:01.520 align:center line:-1 Afterwards, I had these muddled memories of the Cultural Revolution, of being an inferior class of person, 45 00:04:01.530 --> 00:04:06.580 align:center line:-1 but then suddenly, later, we had the right to set up an organization. 46 00:04:06.590 --> 00:04:09.990 align:center line:-1 We could also establish organizations, and could also rebel. 47 00:04:10.000 --> 00:04:25.650 align:center line:-1 Rebel against the Bourgeois Reactionary Line, and put the blame on Liu [Shaoqi] and Deng [Xiaoping]’s shoulders. 48 00:04:25.660 --> 00:04:31.130 align:center line:-1 No one was innocent, because we also set up a Red Guards organization. 49 00:04:31.140 --> 00:04:36.890 align:center line:-1 We could also go into the streets, to participate in the so-called rebel movements, 50 00:04:36.900 --> 00:04:41.180 align:center line:-1 plan to persecute other people, and even take part in violent struggle. 51 00:04:41.190 --> 00:04:48.680 align:center line:-1 Although we did so inconspicuously, we were, after all, following along, waving flags and shouting. 52 00:04:48.690 --> 00:04:59.940 align:center line:-1 We attacked people; no one in our group was uninvolved. I don’t believe there were really any “bystanders.” 53 00:04:59.950 --> 00:05:08.990 align:center line:-1 Born in such a family, if you wanted to prove you were revolutionary, the only way was to join the movement. 54 00:05:09.000 --> 00:05:17.200 align:center line:-1 How many people were actually able to completely not participate, not be involved at all, I didn’t pay attention to that; I don’t know. 55 00:05:17.210 --> 00:05:24.530 align:center line:-1 But I knew that I wanted to work hard to do well, to show that I was a member of the movement. 56 00:05:24.540 --> 00:05:32.020 align:center line:-1 What kind of people there are results in what kind of leaders. The so-called Four Greats was made by our uproar. 57 00:05:32.030 --> 00:05:37.780 align:center line:-1 Later, in the activities of crowding onto trains and “great networking,” we were all fearless fighters. 58 00:05:37.790 --> 00:05:42.100 align:center line:-1 I remember the five yuan [CNY, Renminbi/RMB] I had on me was stolen as soon as I arrived in Beijing. 59 00:05:42.110 --> 00:05:47.890 align:center line:-1 We got free room and board staying in a Beijing hutong [alley], at a “reception station” [for the Red Guards]. 60 00:05:47.900 --> 00:05:52.450 align:center line:-1 We were all members of the Red Guards, all following the crowds. 61 00:05:52.460 --> 00:06:04.190 align:center line:-1 Later, what stayed in my mind were the poor people in our compound, such as the former professors, 62 00:06:04.200 --> 00:06:17.710 align:center line:-1 who were made to unclog human waste from the sewer as a humiliating punishment. 63 00:06:17.720 --> 00:06:26.290 align:center line:-1 These people were academic authorities, people from whom you used to maintain a respectful distance. 64 00:06:26.300 --> 00:06:33.110 align:center line:-1 So in our compound, there were many who hanged themselves, overdosed, or jumped off of buildings to commit suicide. 65 00:06:33.120 --> 00:06:38.390 align:center line:-1 Later, lots of people were expelled, and instead many of the so-called revolutionary masses moved in. 66 00:06:38.400 --> 00:06:48.820 align:center line:-1 They were all workers, peasants and soldiers, who belonged to the red families. 67 00:06:48.830 --> 00:06:53.920 align:center line:-1 The identity of our compound totally changed. 68 00:06:53.930 --> 00:07:01.790 align:center line:-1 Then all of a sudden, it came to an end, and we were sent down to the countryside. 69 00:07:01.800 --> 00:07:13.570 align:center line:-1 Later, as I grew and matured, I didn’t just think that the Cultural Revolution brought me a kind of anger or a trauma that I can’t get over, 70 00:07:13.580 --> 00:07:18.110 align:center line:-1 but I also felt that each person was responsible for it. 71 00:07:18.120 --> 00:07:24.570 align:center line:-1 It’s like the Germans’ reflection. Didn’t we all enthusiastically support [the Cultural Revolution]? 72 00:07:24.580 --> 00:07:27.050 align:center line:-1 Didn’t we risk our lives expressing ourselves? 73 00:07:27.060 --> 00:07:31.390 align:center line:-1 Human beings cannot choose their own era; this is very sad. 74 00:07:31.400 --> 00:07:39.250 align:center line:-1 In this era, I described myself as the ashes from a volcanic eruption. 75 00:07:39.260 --> 00:07:46.000 align:center line:-1 After the eruption, we were all bits of dust in the falling ashes. 76 00:07:46.010 --> 00:07:56.020 align:center line:-1 Starting out it was burning hot, but after turning to ashes it was a kind of loss. 77 00:07:56.030 --> 00:08:01.260 align:center line:-1 I think it is necessary to preserve this type of memory. 78 00:08:01.270 --> 00:08:06.750 align:center line:-1 If our generation refused to talk about the Cultural Revolution, it would be terrible. 79 00:08:06.760 --> 00:08:17.070 align:center line:-1 This black page is a national shame. Personally, I want to write about it for the rest of my life. 80 00:08:17.080 --> 00:08:23.680 align:center line:-1 One’s writing ability doesn’t matter, but it definitely must be true. 81 00:08:23.690 --> 00:08:26.780 align:center line:-1 Truth is the top priority. 82 00:08:26.790 --> 00:08:46.850 align:center line:-1 Actually, I recently wrote something, and the book I wrote is currently under review due to sensitive content. 83 00:08:46.860 --> 00:08:56.370 align:center line:-1 Some people suggested I write a postscript for the book, so I wrote a piece concerning the importance of memory. 84 00:08:56.380 --> 00:09:08.130 align:center line:-1 Sometimes when I’m in some place, for example, sitting in an American university library, I don’t have any connection to my surroundings, 85 00:09:08.140 --> 00:09:13.710 align:center line:-1 but sitting there, I feel my memory is really rich. 86 00:09:13.720 --> 00:09:22.670 align:center line:-1 I sincerely think over the experience of growing up and every stage of life I went through. 87 00:09:22.680 --> 00:09:33.680 align:center line:-1 Regarding the Cultural Revolution, my point of view is this: try to ponder it as far as possible, not only to vent. 88 00:09:33.690 --> 00:09:41.550 align:center line:-1 Why do we vent? After all, in those days we were all lending our enthusiastic support, for fear that we weren’t revolutionaries ourselves. 89 00:09:41.560 --> 00:09:51.280 align:center line:-1 For example, when we were participating in the “great networking,” when we were crowding onto a train, my younger brother couldn’t get on. 90 00:09:51.290 --> 00:10:00.620 align:center line:-1 He and his classmates pushed on the train’s window, because they couldn’t get through from the door. 91 00:10:00.630 --> 00:10:05.490 align:center line:-1 It was dangerous, you know? They might have been thrown under the wheels. 92 00:10:05.500 --> 00:10:13.200 align:center line:-1 I remember that my brother said, "Never mind. If I'm pushed down, I can be a hero -- I’m Lei Feng." 93 00:10:13.210 --> 00:10:20.930 align:center line:-1 He had become fanatical to this kind of irrational degree. Though he was still young, he felt that life was not important. 94 00:10:20.940 --> 00:10:26.130 align:center line:-1 What was important [to him] was: “I am part of it. I’m able to embody the spirit of Heroism.” 95 00:10:26.140 --> 00:10:27.920 align:center line:-1 I think this is so horrible. 96 00:10:27.930 --> 00:10:43.540 align:center line:-1 How could we, in our time of growing up, get into this so-called idealistic, illusory, impersonal era, an era drowned by Groupism? It’s too horrible. 97 00:10:43.550 --> 00:10:47.780 align:center line:-1 Our concept of self-awareness gradually woke up in the 1980s. 98 00:10:47.790 --> 00:10:56.740 align:center line:-1 Slowly we had desires, which was actually a good thing. If you have desires, you understand what is human, what is individual. 99 00:10:56.750 --> 00:11:03.580 align:center line:-1 Having a life is a minimum right. Back then [during the Cultural Revolution,] there was no life; 100 00:11:03.590 --> 00:11:08.160 align:center line:-1 we desperately went into the streets to pass out fliers, to put up “big-character posters.” 101 00:11:08.170 --> 00:11:16.040 align:center line:-1 We even got up in the middle of the night to do these things. We thought we were great, were revolutionary. 102 00:11:16.050 --> 00:11:20.070 align:center line:-1 You might say it's laughable, preposterous, but that was what we went through. 103 00:11:20.080 --> 00:11:27.010 align:center line:-1 As teenagers, we were incredibly fanatical, stupid, and rash. 104 00:11:27.020 --> 00:11:37.170 align:center line:-1 If what happened is not narrated in detail, we lived in vain. 105 00:11:37.180 --> 00:11:39.950 align:center line:-1 Interviewer: Very good. 106 00:11:39.960 --> 00:11:42.560 align:center line:-1 Very unorganized. 107 00:11:42.570 --> 00:11:49.909 align:center line:-1 Interviewer: Oh no, very good. Thank you for accepting my interview.
Reddit
Twitter
Facebook