WEBVTT 00:00:05.000 --> 00:00:11.000 Craig Meinbresse: Okay. Now you can tell me a little bit about the military. 00:00:11.000 --> 00:00:33.000 Jose Alonzo: All I know about the military is, like I tell you, you had a service for years, but you don't get paid like you here. If you eat enough to buy tobacco, that'd be it. That's why most of us come over here to get away from the military service. 00:00:33.000 --> 00:00:41.000 Meinbresse: The day of a draft. Or do people enlist to just a draft? Draft. Draft. And how did they work that? 00:00:41.000 --> 00:02:35.000 Alonzo: Well, they weren't so many every year, see, and it goes by numbers and somebody is lucky they're exempt on account of the number he draws or something like that. I don't know too much about that. All I know that sometimes whoever is supposed to go, they, you know, they get a certain number that they exempt from the exempt you from the service. And after the after every they filled up their quota, then the rest of it, they go scot free. Yeah, most of us come over here in kind of the 74 years in the Army. And at that time they had the war out in Africa. You know, a place they call it Malaysia. A lot of people get killed over there. They had war over there for a long time with the I think it were the Moors. And then. That was in the 20s. And then somebody come in and they they stopped that right away. Well, something like Vietnam, you know, they go over there, I guess, for nothing or something like that. And. 00:02:35.000 --> 00:02:43.000 Meinbresse: Well, they call those guys. Mercenaries for like a mercenary. 00:02:43.000 --> 00:02:44.000 Alonzo: They had some. 00:02:44.000 --> 00:02:45.000 Meinbresse: Do it for pain. Yeah. 00:02:45.000 --> 00:03:20.000 Alonzo: Yeah, they had some like that. Over there they call them the Foreign Legion. Oh, see. Legion Extranjera. That's the Foreign Legion. They had that over there. 00:03:20.000 --> 00:03:23.000 Meinbresse: Do you remember what year you left Spain to come here? 00:03:23.000 --> 00:03:32.000 Alonzo: 1920. I arrived here in Sonora in 19 June the 20th, 1920. 00:03:32.000 --> 00:03:38.000 Meinbresse: Do you remember where you left out of in Spain. What town? Oh, we. 00:03:38.000 --> 00:03:39.000 Alonzo: Came through France. 00:03:39.000 --> 00:03:40.000 Meinbresse: You came from France? 00:03:40.000 --> 00:04:05.000 Alonzo: Across the border in. Uh, I just can't remember the name of that town in Frontier France. In Spain? I can think of that place now, the name of that town. And when you cross from Spain to France. 00:04:05.000 --> 00:04:11.000 Meinbresse: How did you get from your town to there? Well. 00:04:11.000 --> 00:04:20.000 Alonzo: I walk 29km. Then I got on a train all the way to France. 00:04:20.000 --> 00:04:22.000 Meinbresse: Did you come with friends? Do you go by yourself? 00:04:22.000 --> 00:04:39.000 Alonzo: Yes. No, one. One fella. He. He lived in Canada. He was educated in Canada. And. But he know this country pretty well. He was a salesman. 00:04:39.000 --> 00:04:41.000 Meinbresse: What was he doing in Spain then? 00:04:41.000 --> 00:05:00.000 Alonzo: Well, he went back for a visit. I see. So I happen to get acquainted with him, and I came with him as far as New York. Then in New York, he. You know, they went to Canada. 00:05:00.000 --> 00:05:02.000 Meinbresse: Remember the name of the ship that you came over on? 00:05:02.000 --> 00:05:05.000 Alonzo: Catalina? A French ship. 00:05:05.000 --> 00:05:13.000 Meinbresse: French ship. Uh, weather. What other type of people were on the ship with you? 00:05:13.000 --> 00:05:51.000 Alonzo: Well, there were quite a few Italians, Portuguese, French, Germans. Americans were if you coming coming in that ship, too. But I don't remember what one of it it was speaking real good Spanish. 00:05:51.000 --> 00:05:54.000 Meinbresse: Did you have any problems on the ship because you were Spanish? 00:05:54.000 --> 00:05:55.000 Alonzo: No, no, no. 00:05:55.000 --> 00:05:56.000 Meinbresse: No problems. 00:05:56.000 --> 00:05:57.000 Alonzo: No problems. 00:05:57.000 --> 00:06:02.000 Meinbresse: Were there any problems at all coming over on the ship? 00:06:02.000 --> 00:06:03.000 Alonzo: No. 00:06:03.000 --> 00:06:05.000 Meinbresse: No bad feelings toward one type of people. 00:06:05.000 --> 00:06:18.000 Alonzo: No, no. Everybody was nice to one another, no matter if you. French, Portuguese, Spanish or whatever. 00:06:18.000 --> 00:06:24.000 Meinbresse: Did you have to have any type of papers or anything to get on this ship? A passport of some sort. You had to. 00:06:24.000 --> 00:06:27.000 Alonzo: Have a passport? Yes, sir. Yeah. 00:06:27.000 --> 00:06:28.000 Meinbresse: And how'd you go about getting that? 00:06:28.000 --> 00:07:09.000 Alonzo: Well, just like you here, if you want to travel from here to Europe or anyplace else, you just go to the county seat to a courthouse, and. You get your passport, your papers over there. Oh, yeah. You cannot come in without papers. One I seen in a vote. That fella that I was coming with, he. He took care of everything we had to do in the boat, You know, like filling up some papers. He took care of all that. 00:07:09.000 --> 00:07:13.000 Meinbresse: Did you. Did they require some type of physical of any sort and examination? 00:07:13.000 --> 00:07:18.000 Alonzo: Oh, yeah. Even in the boat, we got examined in the boat. 00:07:18.000 --> 00:07:20.000 Meinbresse: And what were they looking for? 00:07:20.000 --> 00:07:30.000 Alonzo: I don't know. To tell you the truth, I don't remember that much. But I know we had a pass a physical in the boat to. Yeah. 00:07:30.000 --> 00:07:36.000 Meinbresse: How were the conditions on the boat? Clean. Dirty. 00:07:36.000 --> 00:08:25.000 Alonzo: First and second class. Real nice. The third class was not too good. I was in second class and I was lucky that I wanted a bit of third class because it was cheaper. But all the. Accommodation was gone already, you know, couldn't take no more on third class. So I had to come in second class, which I was glad the way I see the third class and the way I came was quite a bit difference. 00:08:25.000 --> 00:08:28.000 Meinbresse: Remember how long the trip took. 00:08:28.000 --> 00:09:08.000 Alonzo: From borders to New York? 18 days. Borders is a port in France where I got on the boat. We had a nice weather except two days and two nights. We had a bad weather those two days, but the rest of it, real nice weather. 00:09:08.000 --> 00:09:17.000 Meinbresse: And where did you land? New York. New York. Did you have to go through any type of immigration? No. 00:09:17.000 --> 00:09:34.000 Alonzo: First and second class. We just walk out on the street. The third class, they had to go to Ellis Island. They abolished that now. I see it in the papers. They abolish that now. But the third class, they had to go over there. 00:09:34.000 --> 00:09:37.000 Meinbresse: How come the difference? 00:09:37.000 --> 00:09:40.000 Alonzo: Searching me? I don't know. That's all I know. 00:09:40.000 --> 00:09:42.000 Meinbresse: Let some go. And all. 00:09:42.000 --> 00:10:45.000 Alonzo: I know. We walk out on the road, in the street. And that man hailed a taxi and we went to New York Central Station. Then from there, this fella that I came with and that other American fella, they took it real good Spanish. They both came with me to the Pennsylvania railroad station. They got my ticket to Sonora. They told me what time they showed me the clock over there, what time the train leaves, what is what steps to take you down to the to the train and so forth. And he wrote in the paper over there, he said, you show this to a. Red in the station and they tell you. That year. The paper said that I didn't know English so that I was going to certain places and so forth. I have no trouble. No trouble. 00:10:45.000 --> 00:10:52.000 Meinbresse: At all? No. That's amazing. 00:10:52.000 --> 00:12:02.000 Alonzo: No. And then when I got off the train here in the north, I didn't see nobody around. I had two neighbors over here, but I didn't see nobody. And I wouldn't have run the station. And I see a man with a horse and a wagon. So I showed him the address of one of the neighbors, and he pointed that way and I showed him the other one, and he pointed this way. At the same time, the couple young boys was walking across the street and the man talked to them. So the boys waved to me. So I come along with them and they brought me here to 12th Street, where there was a place with a few Spanish people. You know, it's like a restaurant or a hotel. The building is still there. People living in there yet? Yeah. As I walk in the door and the other fella was come out and I talked to him. I said, Is there any Spanish people here? He said, there's more in here than in Spain. 00:12:02.000 --> 00:12:07.000 Meinbresse: And he had no trouble once you got here? No. No. 00:12:07.000 --> 00:13:26.000 Alonzo: Who you want to see? I told him. He said, Well, you met him in in the ocean. He was going to Spain, back to Spain. So I asked him. But the other one, he said he lives on Third Street. So they took me over over there and I met that neighbor of mine. But I tell you, when I when I went to that, that was like a boarding house, you know? Not long after I got over there. If I had money to go back to Spain, I would have went back at that same day. How come? Well, where's my 14 boarders in that house in Coppell Over was put a while you know. And that's the ones that they started talking to me in the first place and I thought all the rest of it was the same. But no, just them two. Yeah. No, the people were nice all the way on a boat. On a train in here. There have a racketeers like it now. 00:13:26.000 --> 00:13:39.000 Meinbresse: So you lived in a boarding house then? Yeah, except for what, 30th Street? 33rd Street? Yeah. Third Street. And, uh, so these were just friends that you knew up there? A friend. 00:13:39.000 --> 00:13:40.000 Alonzo: A neighbor. 00:13:40.000 --> 00:13:41.000 Meinbresse: A neighbor. A neighbor from where? 00:13:41.000 --> 00:13:57.000 Alonzo: From Spain. Spain? Yeah. The rest of it was in Spanish. A couple of it wasn't too far from where I came from and the other village over there. 00:13:57.000 --> 00:14:02.000 Meinbresse: So this this area where you went here in Nora, was that mostly Spanish people? 00:14:02.000 --> 00:14:18.000 Alonzo: No, no. It was only that boarding house over there. The rest of the colonies, they live in this section in here from 11th Street to way down on the end of the 15th Street. Most of the Spanish living in this section. 00:14:18.000 --> 00:14:23.000 Meinbresse: What did you do your first couple of days or your first couple of weeks here in the United States? 00:14:23.000 --> 00:14:34.000 Alonzo: You know what? The day after I arrived that never mind, took me in a meal to got me a job and he did get me a job. The second day I went to work. 00:14:34.000 --> 00:14:36.000 Meinbresse: Oh, that's pretty good. 00:14:36.000 --> 00:14:53.000 Alonzo: No physical examination or nothing. And you know where I started work? By this bridge here. This is a brick building over there yet And what was lot more buildings over there, but they tore them down, you know, But in that brick building, that's where I was working. 00:14:53.000 --> 00:14:55.000 Meinbresse: Which. Which mill was that? 00:14:55.000 --> 00:15:00.000 Alonzo: Us Steel mill. Yeah. 00:15:00.000 --> 00:15:03.000 Meinbresse: You had no problem at all getting in there. You had a friend in there. 00:15:03.000 --> 00:15:06.000 Alonzo: Well this one in the boarding house. 00:15:06.000 --> 00:15:08.000 Meinbresse: Now what type of work did you do down there? 00:15:08.000 --> 00:15:49.000 Alonzo: Well, a laborer pick and shovel and a Wilbur. We used to wheel the stuff in from outside or unload it from cars. You know, boxcars, Clay. Like they make it something for the next department over here. Make it out of clay. And then. And I had me zinc workers. They were short of men and they they transferred me to the zinc works. And I work over there. For for three years. 00:15:49.000 --> 00:15:51.000 Meinbresse: The day of a union down there? 00:15:51.000 --> 00:15:52.000 Alonzo: No. 00:15:52.000 --> 00:16:01.000 Meinbresse: No union at that time. Do you remember what type of wages you made? 00:16:01.000 --> 00:16:59.000 Alonzo: I don't remember exactly when I started, but then I started in on the 22nd of June in 1920 and in 1921, in March, and most of it shut down. So I got laid off. But then when we went back in October of 21, they cut their wages way down. I remember that time we was making $2.40 for eight hours work, ten hours work, not eight, ten, $2.40. Yeah. 00:16:59.000 --> 00:17:03.000 Meinbresse: See. So how long did you work down here at. 00:17:03.000 --> 00:17:11.000 Alonzo: I work at two 1925. Then I left and went to the mine. 00:17:11.000 --> 00:17:12.000 Meinbresse: Where was this? 00:17:12.000 --> 00:17:13.000 Alonzo: That in Ohio. 00:17:13.000 --> 00:17:15.000 Meinbresse: What town? In Ohio? 00:17:15.000 --> 00:17:42.000 Alonzo: Saint Clairsville and I worked in that mine. 25. 26 and part of 27. And then the they broke their union. So I come back to the mill. To to the. 00:17:42.000 --> 00:17:44.000 Meinbresse: It works here in the north. 00:17:44.000 --> 00:17:45.000 Alonzo: Yeah. 00:17:45.000 --> 00:17:47.000 Meinbresse: What type of work did you do in the mine there. 00:17:47.000 --> 00:18:24.000 Alonzo: And what they call they work whatever the supposed to be done. Clean slate or fall sometimes go and clean it or put the crossbar, you know, to brace the roof so it don't come down. Seems like that. And I didn't I didn't load no coal. Yes. What they call they work during. Yellow ray track or helping lay track or whatever needs to be done. That's all. 00:18:24.000 --> 00:18:27.000 Meinbresse: And what type of people did you work with there? 00:18:27.000 --> 00:18:32.000 Alonzo: Most of it. Croatians, really nice people. 00:18:32.000 --> 00:18:34.000 Meinbresse: Any particular reason why they were mostly Croatian? 00:18:34.000 --> 00:18:38.000 Alonzo: Not I don't know. All I know is that most of the Croatians. 00:18:38.000 --> 00:18:44.000 Meinbresse: Did you have any problems there because you were Spanish? No, no, no. 00:18:44.000 --> 00:18:53.000 Alonzo: It was only three Spaniards. Three? Three of us Spanish over there in that mine. We never had no trouble. 00:18:53.000 --> 00:18:58.000 Meinbresse: Did you live together? The three Spanish fellows? Yeah. 00:18:58.000 --> 00:19:01.000 Alonzo: Yeah. In the boarding house and one boarding house. 00:19:01.000 --> 00:19:03.000 Meinbresse: Do you remember what kind of rent you paid there? 00:19:03.000 --> 00:20:10.000 Alonzo: Oh, we don't pay no rent. We pay so much for room and board. There was $25 in two weeks. I remember that, right? At that time, it seemed like a lot of money, you know. But we was making pretty good in the mine. Mine wages at that time, it was $7 and a half, eight hours work, you know, 1925 and 26, $7 and a half was pretty good. Yeah. And the the ones the cut the call were called machine. You know, they cut the call. So when the loader shoot him, so they come down, they're the ones that was making bigger money, two and $300 a day, believe it or not. But they didn't have no way to say they work in tonnage. Yeah. 00:20:10.000 --> 00:20:12.000 Meinbresse: They have a union now. 00:20:12.000 --> 00:20:18.000 Alonzo: They did. But like I told you, they broke it in 1927. 00:20:18.000 --> 00:20:21.000 Meinbresse: And what happened then? 00:20:21.000 --> 00:20:38.000 Alonzo: The people they said the company owns the the house and that mine and most of the mining towns. They throw the miners out. The miners was living in the field in a tent or something like that. 00:20:38.000 --> 00:20:44.000 Meinbresse: Yeah. What did the mining company own? Everything stores. 00:20:44.000 --> 00:22:02.000 Alonzo: Well, was a sort of a day with the men running the store. And it was an accompaniment. He didn't work in a he. He had a store. He run the store over there close to the mine. And then later on, he was in town. He he'd run a butcher shop in town. But but I guess he he had to pay the company to run the store over there, you know, rent for the building. And they also had a great big building. Whoever come along don't have no place to live. Go over there. Because you had to pay the same as someplace else. But the company furnished that building. Somebody was running it. Like when we went over there, we didn't go to that big place. We went to a family over there. They had a big home and a few spare rooms, so we bought over there instead of going in with all the other boarders and that big a place. 00:22:02.000 --> 00:22:07.000 Meinbresse: Did you face any type particular problems living there? 00:22:07.000 --> 00:22:26.000 Alonzo: No. No problem at all. Like I tell you, most of those Croatians and the the board. The board and boss was. Powerless, I think, or. Or something like that. Nice people. I never had. No problem. No place? 00:22:26.000 --> 00:22:31.000 Meinbresse: No. How long did you work at that mine? 00:22:31.000 --> 00:23:03.000 Alonzo: From 2526 and part of 27. And then we moved to Cleveland for three years. Then the depression came along and I come back to the mine. But at that time, it wasn't like before. Come back to the mine. I was working for $2.65. Eight hours. During the Depression. 1941, 42, 43. 00:23:03.000 --> 00:23:08.000 Meinbresse: And how did you find things during the Depression? 00:23:08.000 --> 00:23:14.000 Alonzo: Died for gone. If you ask me. 00:23:14.000 --> 00:23:16.000 Meinbresse: Did you have trouble buying food? 00:23:16.000 --> 00:23:46.000 Alonzo: No. No. I was lucky. My father in law had food to spare. He. Yeah, he had a bigger place over there. He had potatoes and cabbage and all that stuff. Milk. He had a cow, too. Well, we put it, put it like. 00:23:46.000 --> 00:23:50.000 Meinbresse: Do you say you were in Cleveland for three years and what did you do there? 00:23:50.000 --> 00:24:07.000 Alonzo: I worked for General Electric. In the department over there where they draw wire for radios and light bulbs. Did you ever see the size of the wire inside a light bulb? Yeah. 00:24:07.000 --> 00:24:30.000 Meinbresse: There's little. Alonzo: Filaments. Yeah. That department that I worked with, that's what we worked on. There's two kinds of wires in the. The two, they're the strongest. They stay up like this, and that's the one I was drawing. The other one they go round is much thinner. That was another department. 00:24:30.000 --> 00:24:33.000 Meinbresse: Uh, what kind of wages did you make there? 00:24:33.000 --> 00:24:36.000 Alonzo: $0.70 an hour to start. 00:24:36.000 --> 00:24:39.000 Meinbresse: $0.70 an hour? Yeah. 00:24:39.000 --> 00:25:51.000 Alonzo: And you get a few cents raise every. Six months. I work over there for three years and then they build a big factory in Mexico and they brought 52 women to this country to learn the trade. And then when they finished building that mill, they send the women back to their mill to run it and they shut the ones over here. That's when I had to go back to the mine. And that small place where I was working in Cleveland, they had a woman from Mexico. Running over. They didn't have it all in one place. They have scattered in different places. Yeah. And then when when that they finished building that factory in Mexico, they send the woman's back and they shut the place over here in Cleveland. 00:25:51.000 --> 00:25:55.000 Meinbresse: Well, how did the men there feel about bringing these women in? 00:25:55.000 --> 00:25:56.000 Alonzo: What do you want to do? 00:25:56.000 --> 00:25:58.000 Meinbresse: Did they pay them less? 00:25:58.000 --> 00:26:06.000 Alonzo: Oh, no. You know what? They were paying the woman $5 a day plus room and board. 00:26:06.000 --> 00:26:07.000 Meinbresse: And what were you making? 00:26:07.000 --> 00:26:18.000 Alonzo: $0.70 an hour. When I start. I was I think it was up to 80 some cents when after three years. 00:26:18.000 --> 00:26:20.000 Meinbresse: That you were paying your own room and board, though. 00:26:20.000 --> 00:26:33.000 Alonzo: Oh, yeah. I was already married. We had our own place. We rent a place over there? 00:26:33.000 --> 00:26:37.000 Meinbresse: Well, what time here in your work history did you get married? 00:26:37.000 --> 00:26:41.000 Alonzo: What? Meinbresse: At what time? And. Oh, you get married. You're talking about being married now? 00:26:41.000 --> 00:26:44.000 Alonzo: 1928. She hooked me up. 00:26:44.000 --> 00:26:49.000 Meinbresse: And where were you at that time? Where did you meet your wife? 00:26:49.000 --> 00:27:00.000 Alonzo: Ohio. When I worked at the mine. Yeah. I used to work with her father sometimes in the mine. I see. 00:27:00.000 --> 00:27:12.000 Meinbresse: So you met her in Saint Clairsville? Yeah. And that was drawing the first time you were there before you went to Cleveland? Yes, it was the first time, Yeah. 00:27:12.000 --> 00:27:21.000 Alonzo: Yeah. I had to drag it along to Cleveland. 00:27:21.000 --> 00:27:29.000 Meinbresse: Uh, let's see. She went back to the mine, then during the Depression. And then what did you do? 00:27:29.000 --> 00:27:37.000 Alonzo: And then in 1933. And March. The mine shut down. Completely shut down? 00:27:37.000 --> 00:27:40.000 Meinbresse: For what reason? 00:27:40.000 --> 00:28:31.000 Alonzo: No profits, I guess. I don't know. And then I. I tried to get a job, and I'm their minds. They gave me a job, but they told me that before I can go to work, I have to become a citizen. And I don't know why I didn't why I didn't want to become a citizen at that time. I cannot say. But the man told me, he said, you go to the courthouse and just put your application in and then come back and I give you the job, he said. And after five years when they called you for examination, if you pass, you keep on working. If not, I have to lay you off. 00:28:31.000 --> 00:28:35.000 Meinbresse: Did you have to take any type of special classes for this becoming citizen? 00:28:35.000 --> 00:29:03.000 Alonzo: No. In the meantime, you know, I just hold back and back and forth, try to get a job someplace else. And I. So one day I decide to go to work. And when I coming home with the papers to go to work the next day, I had a letter from a neighbor who was working here. He said, You come over here. He said, I there's a job in here for you. So I come over here in 1943, in July. 00:29:03.000 --> 00:29:04.000 Meinbresse: Back to dinner? 00:29:04.000 --> 00:29:12.000 Alonzo: Yeah, in July. And I've been here ever since. 00:29:12.000 --> 00:29:15.000 Meinbresse: So what type of job did you get when you came back here? 00:29:15.000 --> 00:30:21.000 Alonzo: Zinc works. And I work in a zinc works in 1957, in November. And then. Stay out. This is in November. Till July. I was out of work. And in your light. I was sitting in a porch in here and. That neighbor over there, her boy, he come out and he called me. He said, Joe, come over here. I thought he want me to help him do something, you know. So I went down. And who was in that? Our priest. I pressed the Westbury and he asked me if I want to work for him. Cleaning the school? Sure. Because I know I couldn't get no job and no place else, you know? 00:30:21.000 --> 00:30:30.000 Meinbresse: Well, you you were talking about the zinc works there. What year was that? 33. You started working there? Yeah. And how long did you work there then? 00:30:30.000 --> 00:30:33.000 Alonzo: Till 57. Till November 57th. 00:30:33.000 --> 00:30:36.000 Meinbresse: Did they have unions down there? 00:30:36.000 --> 00:30:45.000 Alonzo: Not when I started. The union. Come in around 1949. I run. I don't know exactly the year. 00:30:45.000 --> 00:30:48.000 Meinbresse: Uh, how did they get around to getting the union in there? 00:30:48.000 --> 00:31:48.000 Alonzo: Well, at that time, you know, President Roosevelt was encouraging the people to organize, you know. And then the fella by the name of Philip Morris. Philip Murray and John L. Lewis. I don't know if you hear about John Lewis. He was the president of the United Mine Workers. They come in and sign up the steel works.
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